so hi everybody I'm Patrice Ettinger I'm
here to do some introductions
I'm the chief privacy officer at Pfizer
and I have the privilege of working with
ia PP to startup women leading privacy
so I get to do these really important
things like introduce our speakers today
so you you all know today's session is
about women on boards of directors and
the the idea for this session really
came out of the fact that not only is
getting women onto corporate boards a
really hot issue today but also we have
a really unique set of experience
amongst the women here at IIT P
experience and privacy and experience
and information security which really
are areas that boards are focused on
that worried about worried about
security worried about GDP are worried
about all these things that didn't use
to be board level issues and now are so
we thought it was really a great idea
for women here and start thinking about
what that might mean for them at any
stage of their career not just math
stuff people who might be board ready
but people who might want to do this ten
years from now 20 years from now and so
we are so excited to have a really great
panel here for you today so first of all
I'm going to introduce our moderator of
lead sa avi is a principal and the
executive vice president at Shulman she
has 15 years of experience in IT risk
management compliance and privacy and
her primary focus is on emerging health
care issues and privacy privacy concerns
for organizations then we have two folks
who are not part of our privacy
community and who were really thrilled
to have here today so starting first on
my left with Alice corngold
Alice's areas of expertise are corporate
governance and sustainability she
provides strategy advisory series
services and facilitates leadership
sorry hasn't the printed a little too
small without my glasses okay we're
going to fix that so I get that right
okay okay I'm going to start that again
so Alice provides strategy advisory
services and facilitates leadership
strategy retreats for board members and
executives from multinational
corporations professional services firms
and global national and regional
nonprofits she is trained in place
several hundred business executives and
professionals on not-for-profit boards
and
very happy to have you here today Alice
and then to Alice's left we have Sheila
running so Sheila is a pioneer and
visionary when it comes to thinking
about women on board so long before
we've been on boards of the Hot Topic
Sheila was focused on women's ability to
serve on corporate boards when she
became the founder and CEO of women in
the boardroom so today she's one of the
nation's top leadership and board
service experts and Sheila excels at
connecting influential women executives
and professionals with the people and
tools that they need to succeed both in
business and in the boardroom and she is
a regular speaker on topics ranging from
women and boards to excelling as a
female leader and Sheila has spoken all
kinds of really fabulous places and good
featured in publications like The Wall
Street Journal the Washington Post and
Huffington Post and so I'm going to turn
this right over to them so you can hear
from the experts on this and turned over
to Omni as our moderator thank you all
very much well thank you everyone and
all I can say is Wow I'm very excited to
be here today you know times are
changing and with today's session is
we're not going to focus on quotas or
percentages of how many women are on
boards and so forth we're going to
really focus on the positive of how this
pendulum has swung and it's now all
organizations are talking about women in
boards so by show of hands how many of
you actually have read or seen of the
fearless girls on Wall Street right yeah
well you know that that was exciting so
on March 8 which was International
Women's Day it really started
heightening our senses of organizations
like State Street Global Advisors wanted
to see women on board so that's what
we're going to focus on today and having
Alice and Sheila here on what steps we
can take as women to be board ready and
to get board leadership so also just
quickly so we understand how many
current women are on non-for-profit
boards great how about for-profit boards
and how many want to be on for-profit or
not-for-profit boards and split it out
mr. smooth it out oh let's split up yeah
yeah how many want to be on
not-for-profit boards how many want to
be on for-profit board great yeah well
great so of Alice so we hear quite often
you know the past two corporate board
leadership sometimes starts from the
non-for-profit board leadership and I
can tell you from my personal experience
I know that I want to be on a corporate
board and but I didn't know kind of the
fundamentals I didn't know about board
governance I didn't even know how board
meetings were run so I decided to learn
about the governance and also share with
my passion of women and children and
start by a non-for-profit and I did I
started learning about you know what
board packages were and you know what
board governance were was so can you
give us your thoughts on how women can
get on non-for-profit board everything
some of just the in depth of
not-for-profit boards thank you is so
terrific to be here and so thrilled to
see the room past week we hoped but this
is beyond I think our wildest
expectations and I love seeing all those
hands raised for interest in nonprofit
and for-profit boards
let me keep an eye on the time to also
okay so because she'll had a lot to say
I'm sure you have lots of questions oh
I'm ensign so so first of all they
there's a tremendous opportunity for
women in particular for men and women
but I think this is particularly special
important for women to develop as
leaders through non-profit board service
and for those who have served on
nonprofit boards it can be a
transformational experience it is the
first time that you're among a group of
peers fully accountable for the mission
and the implementation of the
organization's work and
it gives you a different view of the
world entirely the people that I work
with in place on ports there's their
change from the experience it for the
first time they really can relate to
what it means for either company or a
non-profit for any entity to be on the
governing board room and the
responsibility and the accountability
and the exit and the ethics and crisis
management of all of the implications of
of being on a non-profit of being on a
board of directors I also wanna talk
about finding the right board being an
effective nonprofit board member and the
extent to which nonprofit board service
could potentially be useful in the past
if you're interested in for-profit
boards so finding the right nonprofit
board is is it's a critical issue and as
we've mentioned earlier I trained and
play several hundred business executives
and professionals on nonprofit boards I
spend months sometimes a year or two
with each candidate and I start with the
premise we're not done until you fall in
love and you think that they think
you're the greatest thing that ever
happened to them and most of the people
I play wind up in leadership positions
often shares the boards and certainly
officers and chairs of committees and
the key is this everyone says well you
have to be passionate about the issue
absolutely
but most people have many many interests
I've worked with candidates there's
often a zigzag in the process where they
start with one thing and then take in
there whether under if that's actually
really what I want to do and I love that
because it's a journey it was like okay
what are we to look at next you know and
they often wind up somewhere they didn't
think they might be interested in and
sometimes it's more match of that person
to the right culture all kinds of fit
issues but here's the biggest factor
just about everyone I interview from the
beginning says I want to be useful I
want to add value and that is the key
because if you're useful you will have a
phenomenal experience and that is where
you will grow and you
shine and develop as a leader and learn
develop skills you will bring back to
work and yes on the path to either
bigger fancier boards but that's what
you want for profit boards and I will
get to that because it's certainly far
from a guarantee but it is like a
parallel career path to your job you
know if you think about volunteer
service and all of its forms and then
nonprofit board service many people
start on the boards of smaller
organizations and then move up depending
on what your interests are so when I
said the key is the opportunity to add
value what that means is looking at
missions and programs this is very nice
and very important but most importantly
you want to understand what the
challenges and the opportunities are
facing each organization that you might
consider so one of the first questions
when I'm assessing a non-profit and
their board needs is is to understand
their revenue model which if you don't
have me working with you you can look on
guys start and find their 990s and it
will give you a pretty good idea and
then the next cut so what are they
trying to accomplish what's the revenue
model to get there and then for
nonprofits and business people are
almost always very surprised at how
complex they are compared to for-profit
but the revenues are mixed of government
philanthropy fees for services a whole
smorgasbord with all kinds of different
timing and expectations it's complicated
and that as I said often surprising to
business people who serve a non-profit
board and every organization like every
company has its challenges so don't be
afraid of that the issue is going in
with your eyes wide open
know what you're getting in for so one
is what are they trying to accomplish
what's the revenue model to get there
and then who was already on the board so
you can tell a lot about an organization
saying with the company with anything by
looking at who is on the
bored if they're very dependent on
corporate philanthropy but the board is
all community activists that's going to
be tough situation doesn't mean you
don't do it but you need to understand
what they need from you and think about
how realistic I would say I do not
introduce people to boards I don't even
consider boards where the CEO isn't
really excellent because then you're not
going to really be able to use your time
productively it can be really
frustrating so I think that's a major
factor so final report it's non-profit
board it is a journey and it is fun and
we agreed we talked about action steps
and I can talk a little bit more later
but first thing is talk to people my
family says I'm obsessed with volunteer
service and nonprofit boards and then I
can go on and on even as family
situations like oh my god there she goes
but we're not make parties or events to
me the icebreaker question is what kind
of service people are involved in and
first of all people light up when they
talk about the nonprofit's they're
involved in and if it's a board then
it's a really juicy conversation and
again people get excited but you will
learn about so many different
organizations and board experiences from
people just by starting to ask those
questions you'll be surprised at how
many people do serve and you'll start to
get the hang of it and you could learn
about an opportunity and learning from
someone who's on a board is very helpful
because as I said it's a matter going in
with your eyes wide open okay looking at
the time okay being an effective
nonprofit board member okay this is
really important obviously you're not
going to do it unless you really want to
do a good job and that's important for
your own satisfaction but also it's a
reflection on you and your firm the
extent to which you perform well so
there really is no point unless you're
going to and what that means there you
can find all kinds of lists
what the role of a board is hiring CEO
strategy and mission etc okay I have
kind of a variation on the theme which
is what I proselytize which is this
oversight is critical many attorneys in
this room oversight is absolutely
essential if you don't fulfill that
responsibility of the board the
organization's in serious jeopardy and
the olden days I said you know the New
York Times test now at social media and
it's a flash you know
it's trouble and hard to recoup from
that but if that's all that a board does
you haven't advanced the ball so you
want in the next three to five years
with your fellow board members to look
back and say hey look what we
accomplished so in order to do that it
means working with the CEO of the board
and this is the consulting work I do to
envision and organizations greater
potential so you know the mission the
compelling value you add but when you
look out to the future where do you want
this organization to be and the CEO can
be very helpful to you and understanding
the landscape so it could be expanding
but it could be narrowing your focus it
could be expanding geographically or
programmatically it will definitely
involve strategic alliances I hardly
know a nonprofit that isn't involved and
it's a great way to enrich offerings so
envision what the greater potential is
that's number one number two what's the
revenue model to maximize success and
that's key because a vision is
meaningless without that and as
businesspeople
you know we understand that and as I
said there's there's it's a real mix of
it's like a patchwork quilt of revenue
opportunities and it's a matter of
figuring out how how do we maximize
success then based on that what is the
role of the board not to see on the
staff the board to maximize success
based on the vision and revenue model
then what are we expecting of ourselves
as individuals and you know that gets
into the gift yet certainly into
attendance at meetings and you don't
have to have a universal case yet but
you might have a guideline and you might
what and that gets to composition so you
want the vision the revenue model role
of the board this specific board not
generic but what do we need to do to
make this happen and then expectations
and then most importantly our
composition okay I'm going to be up soon
good time we'll have many much more time
to talk but board composition is
critical so if you're going to build a
team of 10 people you don't say oh let
me go 5 10 people who like what we do
you have an idea of what you're looking
for so once you understand the vision
the revenue model the role of the board
then you can say what is the mix what is
the diversity of skills experience
expertise networks relationships what do
we need what's the smallest group that
can accomplish this job and what does it
look like and then think about who you
have the fits in and who is on the board
who no longer can produce in terms of
where you're going next thank them
celebrate them they need to move off but
it's because you're in a new stage for
the organization and then you
identifying recruit the people you need
to fill out this picture of ideal board
composition the next is the committee
structure board meeting agendas
everything aligned with what you're
trying to accomplish as a board to
maximize the organization success so
that's really the way I would lay it out
the final point I can elaborate on any
of this is the extension which nonprofit
board service might potentially be
useful paving the way for a private or
public company fort I wrote an article I
saw that I had copies to bring but I
didn't have reprinted but it's online
it's called amassing your governance
capital and I interviewed lots of CEOs
and board chairman of public companies
and and search firms etc etc and what
was clear it has a lot of really good
stories and lessons what's clear is
being on a non-profit board is your
shield will tell you does not promise
you a place ultimately on a for-profit
board but there is no one so it's not a
project public company board that
have not served on nonprofit boards not
a one and this is what every chairman
told me this is what every CEO told me
this is what every term and it's obvious
and it really is a learning experience
is critical
and as you move up in the ranks one of
the women in the story started in her
20s at a local why wound up on the board
of Stanford through those relaxed
relationships she met someone who put
her on her first private company board
and now she's on tons of boards and
reads them etc so on the write boards
although I work with a small
organization and it's an all CEO board
the budgets three million but everyone
gives us a minimum of six figures and
it's an all CEO board if you are on a
board with the right people and do a
really good job this is this is a
valuable opportunity so I will stop at
this I will say that everyone in this
room brings incredible value on privacy
on security legal strategy risk
management think about your superpowers
what you bring to the table and you
should do this you should absolutely do
it there's just a it's a
transformational experience for everyone
I know who who's done it so I will cut a
fair Sheila has a lot to tell us thanks
Allison I can I can echo that when I
spoke with Alice on the phone the second
question she asked me was what board I
was on and what my passion was so thanks
oh thank you for that and you know one
thing I would add to that is what I was
looking for a non-for-profit board to
join I realize that you know it's not
your personal interest it's going to be
the interest of the community or
interest of the board that you have to
focus on so find a board that you're
very passionate about because there are
lots of challenges and you know lots of
health that not-for-profits need so you
have to be very passionate about what
the causes so now let's kind of move to
Sheila you know I come from the
accounting world and when sarbanes-oxley
came they decided you know there has to
be a financial expert on the board and I
know most of the people in here are
either privacy or like myself security
and what I think about joining a
for-profit board I always ask myself
what value
I add and I recently wrote an article
about you know I think privacy and
security should be on the boards because
that's a new emerging topic as well so
so I know that's something that we all
probably in this room have in common
about what value can we add but if you
can go into a little bit more depth on
corporate boards and maybe the
responsibilities that we would have I
will can you read me again how much time
I have you have 10 to 15 minutes okay a
lot of information to go through very
quickly G then we Allison I could do
this on separate sessions for sure and
we're Pekka nated all into one so
forgive me if I talk really fast but I
absolutely want to make sure that we
have time left for your guys's questions
so absolutely go for the nonprofit
boards journey I'd never want women to
stop doing their charitable work I just
would like you to be paid for it so um
other boards that you might want to
think about you know the media loves to
focus on the fortune 500 board and
that's where you're going to see all the
stat and it just it's not the big
picture they're not the only game in
town right so make sure that you
remember that there's also these smaller
public boards also privately held
company boards and advisory board
advisory boards can mean many different
things it could be first startups it
could be an advisory board for a very
large company and you know Walmart has
an advisory board and we're not a search
firm but we do get in a lot of board
opening isn't one of the board of things
we got in was for the diversity advisory
board for Toyota and they paid a hundred
grand and they give you far not a bad
stick right so don't forget about the
advisory boards they're always a really
great place to start so alright so let's
talk about you know the job and
responsibilities and I'm just seriously
I'm so sorry I have these in front of me
but I have shiny object syndrome so if I
see something I'll forget like when I
was talking about or I'll get
sidetracked I just at least have to have
these plus I've got 10 minutes ago all
right so responsibilities of a director
first and foremost is to hire
evaluate and if necessary fire the CEO
it's to bring on other board directors
it is certainly to make sure that
they're in compliance with you know all
of the different regulations that they
have going on of course overseeing the
financial performance overseeing
strategy so it is you know I'm in hands
oh right because you are not management
you're not the CEO then being an
effective board member just as much as
you talked about with the nonprofit's
pretty much the same I'm not going to go
into that a lot you want to make sure
you're getting along with your fellow
board members and you definitely need to
be prepared these are in addition to
what she's said you know sometimes it's
a lot to read through those board
packets before the meeting base I'm
pretty sure we've all been in meetings
where people haven't been prepared and a
little bit of million and then of course
effects company goes into crisis mode
you're probably going to have to be
there in triple time so just keep that
in mind if you have a job right so the
risks of serving of course you want to
make sure that the board always has D&O
insurance directors and officers
insurance your reputation will never be
covered by insurance so make sure that
no matter what kind of board you're
getting on that you are really doing due
diligence you know and and alice' talked
about knowing who the other board
members are and the CEO absolutely know
who the audit company is you know check
out the company thoroughly just because
somebody asked to be on the board does
not mean you should go on that board you
need to do your due diligence and you
know keep in mind too that if the price
does think you might be sued so you know
it's going to be covered under dnl
insurance as long as you are performing
your due diligence the time commitment
of serving is you know the average for
what NACD puts up the National
Association of corporate directors is
that for corporate board on average is
children 50 to 300 hours per year and
you know I've had directors tell me that
that's really high and then for private
boards it can be more but most likely
it's going to be less these are the
things that you're finding out in the
interview process for sure but again
it's just all part of you're doing your
due diligence so compensation because I
know that's always of interest everybody
right so for for times sake we're just
going to say that the public boards you
can find that information online in
their proxy all right all of that is
right there for you private boards
really will range and because they're
private we don't really know what
they're paying their directors all the
time but it could be anywhere from you
know they're giving their board members
at a smaller board it might be $5,000
you know retainer with some equity or
you go up the big private companies
we'll definitely near the the public
companies which you know could be a lot
of money like half million you know two
hundred fifty thousand and that would
include both cash and stock just
remember you have to pay taxes on that
so it's it's best should definitely not
be the only reason why you want to be on
board is for the compensation and let's
see so why pursue board service besides
the compensation of course is definitely
an intellectual challenge you're at the
table with extremely smart people and
you know if you are still in your career
they definitely can be a big boost for
your career as well and you're learning
all the time of course it's a great
resume and reputation builder as well
you know it's just everybody's
motivation is always going to be
different but what we hear all the time
is that no matter what they're getting
they are they're giving they're
definitely getting more out of it so
definitely worth the time so the
different skills that we're seeing that
our need is definitely that risk
you know so we've gotten in probably a
hundred and thirty different board
openings down the last couple of years
which is amazing so I took I have a
really good pulse on what boards are
looking for and thank goodness it isn't
just the financial expert anymore and
that really started to shift pretty
dramatically five seven years ago I
can't believe I've been doing this for
50 years so it's really crazy I think
they started one of 25 yeah um no I
didn't and so um what would they see
shiny object right right there what was
I talking about
oh right skillset pink that was the test
make sure you guys are listening so
technology is definite so yes it's
changed a lot in the last five to seven
years especially in the last three years
which is really great news for all of us
that are not a financial expert right so
there's certainly our boards that are
looking for them they need they need
them on their board for sure but they
don't need a table full of them anymore
so technology risk management HR talent
management operations I mean we've seen
it all sales and marketing M&A
experience we've had you know companies
come to us that are looking for you know
someone with retail experience that's a
digital disruptor um you know
engineering the technology specialist so
it's really all across the board
so don't let that hold you back all
right what am I forgetting like you know
a question that I think a lot of us
probably may have is how do we find out
about for openings I know going to
somebody like you but one or some other
way there you know what you can get hear
about board openings through so many
different services these days and you
know sign up to be a part of a database
or whatever but it's just there's no
easy way to the boardroom it's all about
networking and you really you need to
make sure that you have your board
portfolio put together that professional
profile
that board bio that really highlights
your skills and background for board
positioning and what I really begun is
working with our numbers on the
networking piece of it so you know it's
really reaching up to your network and
those influencers and connectors and you
know a lot of times we're so focused on
our current network that we forget that
we have people that we you know I mean
how many times you run into Joe that
you've known for twenty years and you
haven't talked about five right so it's
really important to make sure that
you're rien gauging with people and you
know we as we're we're such great
networkers really we are but we are not
good at using our network we're not good
for asking for help
it's like I'm accession what can I do
for you what can I do for you and um you
know what I've really learned too is
that really digging in and figuring out
like if someone says oh the networking
processes that work for me on like let's
see what you're doing wrong because I
know what does right I mean we have so
many of our members getting on boards to
this networking process and what I find
really so we'll do like a role playoffs
I hope you what is it that you're saying
to this person and I found out that
they're saying to them oh my gosh Sally
you know I'm really interesting getting
onto a board and I know you've been
there and you've done that so how did
you do it what advice do you have for me
and I'm like that's what I'm here for
you come to me for that information you
go to your network ready right so
there's a big difference from that
conversation to them going to them with
that elevator pitch of hey Sally I want
to let you know I'm really interested in
getting into a corporate board and I'm
looking for small or mid-cap you know
private our public companies
specifically I'm looking for something
in retail hospitality health care and my
skill set for verbal board service is
boom boom boom and then you end it with
would love to know if there's anyone in
your network that you can catch me - big
difference between those two so it is
but it's the process because we have to
get
over that fear of you know not wanting
to ask for help and you know there's
also the right way to reach out to
people and when to reach out to them and
then you can't assume either that you've
told them once and they're supposed to
remember so you have to maintain great
thank you for that
so we constantly read there's number of
reasons why I need gender diversity on
boards you know can be better
decision-making understanding your
consumer base better I think the one
that I read that was most powerful to me
was that it increases financial
performance when you have a gender
diverse board so there are the the
Pearson Institute's that you know if you
have 30% female leadership it could add
up to 6% points on your net margin and
McKinsey and company actually said the
companies are 15 percent more likely to
outperform their peers when they have
gender diversity so I'm going to ask you
two questions
Allison and Sheila is what will one
what's the biggest challenge or
significant barrier to have a female
leadership and then two what do you feel
that the number one reason should be or
one of your top reasons to have that
gender diversity on board so and I
actually put an article at your tables
called better better boys better
government
I think that's or a variation on that
because I wrote a chapter to book on
that to like talking about the
for-profit companies to begin with
because it's it's a very clear cut in
terms of company maximizing its
potential financially and in terms of
shareholder value the average in the S&P
500 the average number of you looking to
put noses average number of board
members is 10 point 7 the average age is
63 it's going up not down that means the
internet came came on when they were 40
so in terms of Technology savviness and
that the odds route there are fewer than
it's 18 percent are women 15 percent are
minority and fewer than one per board
something like six or six point seven
percent of my value city sits in the are
our people have been for who were born
in a country other than the US so think
about that and the fact that three
billion people are entering the middle
class in emerging markets a massive
market opportunity that an Africa alone
consumer facing industries are will see
an increase is four hundred billion
dollars that women make 75% of
discretionary spending decisions
worldwide so these are massive market
opportunities in my mind the role of a
for-profit board parallel to a
non-profit board is to imagine this
company's greater potential in the
global marketplace well to do that if
you've got a very homogeneous group of
people I don't care who they are they're
homogeneous but basically you have old
white men I mean that's that's the
demographic then and with similar
backgrounds you know having grown up in
the United States similar backgrounds
how can a group like that how can they
possibly imagine a company's greater
potential and also given the the the
lack of the internet and technology and
which is at the center of all of the big
opportunities not to mention security
privacy etcetera so imagine instead
aboard with people from a variety of
different backgrounds ages genders
having grown up in different countries
they can still be running major
companies c-suite people PhD from MIT oh
you know all the qualifications that you
want but that kind of board I would bet
my money on in terms of imagining what's
possible and even knowing what questions
to ask so I think it's I mean and an
oddly said I mean all the data point to
less fraud less conflict of interest
higher ROI we all all of the benefits
are heavily documented now McKinsey
Credit Suisse you mentioned some there
are many studies now non-profit board
just imagined similarly so I've been
working with nonprofit boards for 25
you're talked about yes you are also on
15 and and boards had been extremely
homogeneous now sometimes it's better
sometimes it's not but how can a
non-profit imagine that organizations
greater potential and understand and
maximize the revenue potential if
they're all from the same group in the
same background and I facilitate
retreats of nonprofit boards and there
were two weekends back to back and one I
was some it was doing the retreat and
all of that a very homogeneous board and
it was an organization that was really
struggling financially and I threw out a
variety of ideas of ways they can reap
they could reach different segments of
the population and each time they're
like oh no no they wouldn't be justified
is that what we're about all they can
imagine were people exactly like
themselves being served and in fact I
didn't even understand how they would
qualify for 501c3 because it was such an
exclusive group and they saw themselves
serving their group exclusively the
following weekend I was facilitating
retreat an education Opportunity
Organization for boys of Latino and and
and Latino and black boys and it was
such a diverse group I'm not talking in
the obvious how people look but there
were highly successful businesspeople
and there was a teacher from one of the
schools there was a white person who
grew up from a guy ran a company very
limited background in education with his
big opportunity every person in the room
had a very unique and different and
unexpected background and as I threw out
each issue it was like a symphony of
what we staviska genomic and then you
know we brought it to a conclusion but
it was like whoa this is so rich the
thinking the ideas that well what about
that and it was just the opposite so
it's just if you know you've all been in
groups where it's everyone's similar
or there's more variety and backgrounds
and you know that the richness of the
vision the ideas understanding risk I
means the mitigating risk is a big issue
so I think it's just it's very clear how
and that the what's the problem mmm this
is being taped well I'm dying over here
just okay you go next by Maya okay I
mean there's a kid on and talked to god
truth
I just can't people who are the people
who are in power why would they want to
relinquish it right okay totally
financially beneficial I mean that's
what it comes down to in my mind right
okay I'm yeah I'm gonna totally
sidetrack this because on that note
right and I'm going up and then going to
anyway so today I'm fine here and in
first class because it was really just
kind of ticket by the way and now that I
have to make any excuses for that but if
ten people nine white dudes in me right
I mean that this is why they're not
giving up those board seats and so I
don't ever talk about the low is us I
might get off your putt I use different
word but we're being tit and do the work
right because you are qualified you are
good enough and they're looking for you
so have that confidence and stop waiting
to check every single box before you go
for it because not only is these white
dudes sitting there I mean like white
privilege is an issue no matter how you
look at it so many ways till tomorrow
and like just get up and do the work
because they're not going to give those
seats up you have to go get them and
it's not to say that old white guys are
just bored
so out of the eleven or something like
that they don't acknowledge that moment
generates I mean but they can bring
something yes I may be absolutely okay
so a couple
to ask investment oh yeah there's no
about artisanal get them but there's
quite a lot of people here that don't
know where to start
right exactly how about think about
where we start or if we want to be
better prepared reports orders what can
we do thank you are actual things that
you all can begin do now right okay so
know why you want sir
right and I have some postcards here by
the way that have these ten tips on here
know why you want to serve create a plan
and you have those board documents that
I talked about that board BA do that
professional profile that highlight your
background forward positioning so that
you really do know your skill set and
that you can articulate that to your
network your personal brand is key of
course make sure you're always doing a
bang-up job wherever you're at because
you're being watched all the time if
you're on those nonprofit boards you
take a leadership role and you show up
because we know too many times that
doesn't happen so always bring your
a-game educate yourself that doesn't I'm
not saying that you know because women
love to do this they're like oh my god
x2 can she come I should go get another
degree I think I should go and become
board certified and I'm not ready and
I'm like yes you are you're good like
how many of those port openings do you
think that have come to us that have
said we're looking for a board director
who's certified zero right so none of
them are looking for that so don't go
and get you don't have to go get
certified it's not today maybe in two
years I don't know but there's plenty of
stuff that you can google read about
webinars all of that information on what
it means to be a board director and if
you have no more experience because you
know besides those nonprofit boards if
you have no experience consider hospital
boards government boards university
boards and if you know entrepreneurism
they need to start an advisory board Tom
started by stir bar to put you on
there's a really great book by a woman
here in DC who verse eleven is called
built to scale and she gives you
step-by-step
you know how to create an advisory board
for your company and you read it you're
the expert that's right you know what be
in it for the long haul there's just
there's no quick and easy way to the
boardroom so like those all those
databases out there with the board
openings you know I just I tell people
all the time actually join them in the
board room because we get in all those
board opening is because it's really
icing on the cake art you know my whole
goal is to help them do the sport that
it takes to put themselves forward and
of course then the networking which I
talked to that's more about I think it's
really interesting that you talked about
government board someone recently told
me too I live in Orlando and I looked at
the city of Orlando and they had 67
board openings and there was one 4ip on
it which is exactly what I do and then
when I submitted it they said I was the
first person to apply in 12 months Wow
oh yeah probably an easy way to get into
that oh cool I may be the IC on its
board member yeah so before I open it up
I'm gonna ask you a personal question
so I got my MBA at Wharton Business
School and I'm not going to say who this
was because everybody knows who this
person is but I was we were we were
taken out to a roundtable discussion and
I asked this person what's the number
one advice that you could give a woman I
was probably late 20s early 30s about
serving on a corporate board and he said
just don't ever get pregnant so the good
thing about Wharton Business School is
50 percent or female and 50 percent are
male so I guess kind of what are you
seeing with some of the people that you
work with of like the influence of
motherhood or Maternity I have young
children myself but that's I mean I'm
still in shock
what else okay I know but um so what
kind of advice I didn't have children at
that time but it was a shock to me as
you know being there a very influential
person I think you're asking me what
kind of advice I would give mothers or
but the subject doesn't come up okay
okay the hele yeah that's why I'm like
what yeah I would be why would that
discussion happen no I be persistent
being it for the long haul
and do the work and you know what
sometimes just got to take it step by
step and yeah I mean we're dealing
there's so many unconscious bias
ensuring that that's it's the problem I
one of the things I love about nonprofit
boards is that most of the time almost
all the time
women can move into leadership positions
most of the time for a non-profit board
if you're willing to say if you know
well who's going to do this who's going
to do that I will and if you love it
I find the busiest people if you love
what they're doing and feel you can be
useful so you will wind up saying I'll
help with that and before you know it
you're helping with things and you wind
up in the leadership role and you why do
people move wind up as chair of the
board and that's an extraordinary
opportunity to develop yourself to show
what you can do to have that sense of
competence and translate that into your
work and potentially for-profit boards
so it's one of the it's the magic of
nonprofit boards it's wonderful there
soon as the barriers are far fewer great
so we have about I think a good 20
minutes do we have questions
great do we have someone who
don't take this week
I believe it was mentioned earlier that
you had said it's more important or its
best or needed to be on a non-profit
board before a corporation board or a
for-profit board is that is that did I
hear that right and if so why is that
important so when I actually the the
publisher for directors rewards asked me
to write an article about this and it's
one called amassing your governance
capital he said you know if you're on a
non-profit board then can you go on to a
for-profit board and or how important is
that
and I interviewed many executive search
firm people who do for-profit board
placement chairs and CEOs of public
company boards and that they basically
said if you're on a non-profit board I
mean this would there's no promise or
reason to think you would wind up on a
for-profit board I mean it depends on
the trajectory that as I said the
opening anecdote I tells of a woman who
did start with a loja why and moved her
way up the ladder and was on the
Stanford University board and that is as
Sheila said universities hospitals where
you meet people usually who could if
they're pressed they can provide access
to invitations to for-profit boards but
what was a hundred percent clear with
everybody and then since then I've sort
of followed it and looked at bios of
people in for-profit boys there is not a
single for-profit board member they said
who has not had a non-profit board
experience and it really is it really is
a Learning and Development experience
and opportunity and they did say that's
not what's going to get you a seat on a
for-profit board but it will come up
recommendations and as Sheila said
whatever you do knew well of course but
we do those are women
and mobilize there but they the word of
mouth and what people think and
certainly about your performance on a
non-profit board that that does come up
but I one of the the CEO and chairs said
to me it's also important to them to
companies that all of their board
members are involved in their
communities one way or another it it
brings a richer understanding of needs
and challenges and issues in the world
and shows support neutral if you wanted
you have an idea say something oh yeah
okay so you don't have to get on to a
non-profit board to get on to a
corporate board right I hear you when
you say that all do and I don't know
that I necessarily agree with that and
I'm not saying I disagree either I just
have not done that research but what I
am s all the time is is serving on a
non-profit board going to help me get
into the board corporate boardroom and I
say well maybe and the reason why is
because if it is a it can if it is a
well-run board so that you're learning
good corporate governance and make sure
it's a large nonprofit board make sure
there's men at the table because you
it's a networking opportunity make sure
of course that you're passionate about
it first I want it I should have said
you know I never want women step during
their charitable work and sometimes when
I go through this list you know I get
that email right and I'm not saying I
want women to set during their trail
work that's not it but again take that
leadership role know those expectations
that you talked about that given the get
also your time commitment do they want
you there for five hours a month or five
hours a week one year or five years both
are my goals and I want to add something
that ties with all of this the second
book I wrote and you've got a brochure
that you have actually the book a better
world Inc how companies profit by
solving global problems where
governments cannot soon as I wrote it
before this administration even then but
okay sorry where DC it's hard not to
and so I there it's filled with dozens
of case
of companies and who are leading the way
in terms of ESG environment social and
governance sustainability etc and it it
makes it very clear the companies do
have an opportunity to profit and grow
value by solving today's most compelling
challenges environmental social and
economic and for every threat poverty is
a threat to companies and their
prosperity and success climate
ecosystems education health care there's
a chapter in each these are all threats
not only to humanity but to prosperity
and company success but every one of
them is an opportunity like in your
field which is really hot is
cybersecurity privacy the greatest
threat but it means for companies that
find solutions innovative solutions the
greatest opportunity to make money and
that provides an opportunity for you the
companies that were successful in
maximizing their potential financially
by finding innovative solutions to three
things well the board understood this so
it's at the board level they partner
with nonprofits that bring credibility
and expertise and relationships in
remote communities or companies don't
understand but want to and they are
effective at stakeholder engagement so
you bring valuable skills to the table
and I think understanding that it really
is about the global marketplace in
today's and tomorrow's world
and innovation this is this is really
what board governance is about certainly
in for profits but also nonprofits other
questions thank you I'm Lauren shy I'm a
member of our women leading privacy
advisory board so first thank you for
your time and your insights in an omni's
case your horrifying story I have to
think a personal experience that might
benefit the the room and it also touches
on Patrice's question about action items
Alice you mentioned broader volunteerism
the nonprofit board membership as
perhaps a component or extension of that
how many people in the room volunteer
that are currently or in the past and no
judgments if you don't raise your hand
but how many of you do actually
volunteer and donate your time perhaps
in your local communities School PTA
anything okay a lot of people I also
volunteer in my local community for a
non-profit and I approached them about
their board and whether there was an
opportunity to be a board member there
after about a year of volunteering one
they were thrilled to know that it was
interested right they don't know unless
you approach them and tell them that you
have an interest and two while a board
position did not materialize it allowed
me to practice some of the things that
Sheila had mentioned which is why I'm
interested in being on a board why I
think I would be a good board member
with an organization that I know so I
would really encourage people to think
about when you go home in the coming
weeks and months approach those
organizations and ask them and go
through your pitch and get the
experience it will benefit you
regardless of whether a position
materializes most nonprofits are always
on the lookout for good candidates
approach them ask them so that's why I
say ask people when you meet them what
they're doing and you will hear about
things there are also online matching
services I think for LinkedIn through
what's wrong with me there but
california-based
counselors know I refer to nonprofit
Matt I'm not non-profit board list I'm
sorry I don't think board source does
that but hmm it's a board match it's a
nonprofit matching service I'll think
I'm sorry I can't believe I'm not
volunteering as a volunteer match okay
so anyhow um and so you can learn about
nonprofits that are looking I would
caution you extremely the percentage of
successful matches you know to me if
it's 70 percent that's a disaster
because it means 30 out of 100 people
wanted to do something and wound up in
up their first board meeting saying oops
this is not what I had in mind
and the CEO boards you're like mmm
don't think this person's going to be
what we need and to me that that's
horrible and then that person tells
other people don't do it you know it is
a matter of really learning and
understanding what's going on at the
organization again what they're trying
to accomplish what the revenue model is
who's on the board what their challenges
and opportunities are and what they need
you to do so use those four lists about
ideas but you do need to do more due
diligence but I think ideally through
people you know and organizations you
know and if you asked five organizations
learn but at least one would be begging
you it's most nonprofits are you know as
I work with candidates there's there's
not a non-profit that's closed to me if
I'm going to introduce someone that
meets what they need that's my job is to
figure so they're they're all looking
and you guys bring a lot to the table so
it's just finding the right match just
the thoughts on purpose
not working very very loud was here in
the back hello okay
so a little different question I had the
great opportunity to be on a board for
two years as a treasurer so treasurer
elect treasurer the second year and then
immediately after that it was quite
exhausting so I didn't really understand
she's nothing the houses yes nonprofit
how much work there was to be done and I
was happy to do it but you know I had
really young kids and everybody gets
that here right most people do so and
they immediately came back and said okay
we've we're nominating you you've been
nominated for president elect yes and it
just for a myriad of reasons personal
and you know I just didn't feel like
because I had two years on the board as
a treasurer that I really still had a
good grasp of the operations and I
really kind of wanted to learn more in a
different role as well maybe a community
role or communications or what have you
before I stepped into that present role
and so I respectfully declined it and
then you know was was actively trying to
pursue something else and it kind of
hurt me and so I was my question is is
that is there some other way I should
have handled that is there you know in
the course of being on the board and I
know there's some natural progression it
doesn't necessarily mean that I want to
go to the top or I want to do everything
on that board
some people do but you know I guess it
just really disappointed me that it's
see it seems like I didn't take that
next step and they you know wouldn't
allow me to do anything else after that
and another organization or is it at
this nonprofit so it was a national one
yeah so it was it all women
okay sorry
but yeah I just didn't know if that was
if you know if I did something you know
was there some other expectation I could
have said or um every organization is
different it's perfectly reasonable to
say
I mean cheer of a board I have such
respect for people who do that it is a
massive yes I mean I finesse and I
haven't in his massive commitment and
I've done other leadership roles and I
built and run social enterprises very
successful ones so and I was a good CEO
but it's humbling when you realize that
you can't maximize an organization's
potential without a grade forward and
it's also the case that it's if you have
a great CEO but not a good board you're
not going to achieve that organization's
greater potential but if you have a
great chair and a weak CEO that can be
fixed I mean really the chair really has
the greatest opportunity to really make
make or break a non-profit in so many
ways so it's a huge responsibility the
fact that you didn't take it should not
you know but every culture and group of
people's girlfriend its group dynamics
but no and everybody we're treasurer to
look for you they're not that good to
happen with men in the room but it's
just unfortunate that these things still
happen
[Music]
with your top loader right yeah I'm not
going to do it I would say listen if
you're not bad enough for the women
you're not well give her a bit wardroom
that's diversity - yeah so thanks again
I echo your comments earlier it's been a
really good conversation I have sort of
it may be a different way in I started
my own nonprofit because there was a
need in the community in the area that
I'm interested in serving and so I have
the jar but it's teeny tiny and we've
had some grants and we've grown but I'm
wondering if you could talk about people
you may have seen in in their progress
from like their own startup nonprofit to
joining more national and bigger
organizations cuz my experience I don't
have mentors randomly that I've worked
with and sponsors and people who help me
but it's all kind of been make it up as
I go along and be interesting to know
how do you bridge from that kind of
scenario to one where you're on a
national board so you're often on profit
is there any pain nap or you do it all
we we do it all we have a grant that's
been paid paying some of our board and
volunteer formally volunteer members
just do some of the deliverables of the
grant that yeah all volunteer
organizations are really tough and often
can't get to the next level until until
that happened until there's a paid
executive director but but doing
incredibly important work it's the same
as anyone else in this room and what
Sheila said with regard to for-profit
saying with nonprofits think about you
know like my grandchildren call them
superpowers think about what you're
really good at
you're clearly entrepreneurial
innovative for problem-solve our
understanding certain issues and these
in the community to understand what and
I bet just one aspect of you that I
think it's kind of apparent from what
you've done for each of you think about
what strengths you bring to the table
and how you've demonstrated them because
that's the conversation
she was talking about this is what I'm
good at and this is why this is what I
can tell you about what I've done so
that you'll understand that and then
then in exploring organizations through
conversations I mean it's organisations
you read about in the paper you know or
online I should say look at who's on the
board look at what they do look at their
revenue model by looking at their 990s
to revise start and think about gee do I
think I could potentially be useful and
then approach them here we'll take one
more question
thank you so much this has just been a
great conversation and you briefly
touched on the time commitment can you
elaborate a little bit more about what
to expect of trying to insert yourself
into board positions while still trying
to manage a full time career and a
family who are you asking both oh yes
well first wife and really bad allergies
I'm not sick by the way so she won't
talk to me afterwards I'm not sick um
you know there's just no such thing as
balance I don't think right one day
you're going to have ninety ten and the
next they're going to have forty sixty
in ten nine to the next day so you have
you know we all do stuff but we want to
get them
now plans that sounds like a tweet and
overall you can hear me Moaning she
Admiral honey along the right I just
comment on that a little bit so I work
for a bank in Wilmington Delaware we're
out here okay I just wanted I just
wanted to comment on this question
because it's very difficult to find time
to do all of these things I was a
chairman of board of communities and
communities in schools of Delaware for
four years and it's a lot of work but
lots of times your employer will allow
you time to do that most of my board
meetings were during the day my
executive meetings were during the day
and provided I got my work done that was
you know it was encouraged actually
that's I might lawyer to do that make
sure that you talk to your employer
before you start going before that board
seat to make sure it's okay because
there's there's nothing worse than being
offered a board seat and then you go
back to your employer they're like and
that is really bad for your brand and
while you do it you're going to add some
to about matching funds and or if it's
not a formal policy they would
potentially provide some financial
support to organizations where you're
involved on the board I know the big
four recently in their benefit package
says that they'll pay for your board
seat so that whatever financial funds
you know you know we're talking about
nonprofits you cannot pay for your car
I've worked on right so actually looks
kind of to wrap it up maybe if I can ask
both that she'll on Alex what are your
final words that you would give us women
today so many advice right Robbie
beginning all I mean obviously all
starts as I just started talking but I'm
so sorry about John have a plan have
some patience there's no easy way to
that corporate boardroom but you're good
enough go get it I like to go get it
team and I would say that and
management is a massive yeah you know I
raised children working full-time I have
grandchildren I'm very very involved if
you know this and my two of my daughters
have children and yeah I mean they work
full-time so it's the one at a law firm
so that's um anyhow yeah
it's a lot so so we know that I think as
I said earlier nonprofit board service
is one of the most incredible
opportunities of a lifetime to do
something meaningful but to grow and
develop personally and it is it is
absolutely transformational for people
most importantly make sure it's a good
fit take the time that it takes to do
that meet the people on the board go on
site visits whatever it takes and in the
mean time in terms of exploring start
asking people you will be so surprised
how many people are serving on nonprofit
boards and have a lot to say and if
you're in this room you're a curious
person because you're a highly
accomplished person it's the journey
itself is at least half the fun you will
learn so much about what's out there you
will learn about yourself and you know I
as the reason I think it's important
when I work with candidates this journey
is because this is not what they do
full-time how could they possibly
imagine all of the possibilities and
I've worked with hundreds and hundreds
of nonprofits but every month I come
across and meet with and visit with a
nonprofit and I think who would imagine
that you exist where you combine this
and that approach to solve this or that
problem no one could even imagine it so
you you'll be surprised at what's out
there and and you will find something if
you really want to look for if you
absolutely will so as if you don't mind
I have one last pot ever before we
adjourn and
oh he said have a plan and you talked
about some really inspiring things that
we can do as we look for nonprofit
opportunities but where you go to start
your plan are there any resources or
things that you can tell people out
where you can see what what kind of plan
you need to have either 20 30 40 50
years old you want to be on board some
digs where do you start that time well
it would depend if it's a for-profit or
nonprofit right so do you know where
nonprofits would go well where would you
go to create a plan I I think I'll like
with anything read learn about the
issues you care about about
organizations definitely as Lauren said
I mean everyone in this room is
volunteering in some capacity I've
always seen that your volunteer career
as parallel to your work career and it's
a inter career path I did career
counseling long time ago and it's a
career path and you learn about yourself
with each engagement what you like and
what you don't like and you develop
different skill sets and oh one of the
other things I love about volunteering
or nonprofit board service is you work
with people usually hopefully from very
different backgrounds on a mission that
you're all very passionate about so you
get to work with people you might not
meet or know in other parts of your life
and that's really fabulous - is there
anything you be more specific that means
we can offer you to people in the
resource right okay so obviously for
corporate boards coming to women in the
boardroom
I would Google the nonprofit one right I
can't imagine that it's really going to
be that that much I mean you do have to
figure out what is it that you're
interested in what are you good at it's
not it's not as complicated is it the
question right and my answer to that is
I'm sorry I just I'm not a
self-promoting kind of person to really
but I put my first book addresses that
first question is called leveraging
goodwill strengthening nonprofits by
engaging businesses and it is about
businesspeople trying to find the right
non-profit board match it's about the
role of nonprofit boards building better
boards
so that's called leverage and goodwill
it's on Amazon and I and this book which
was just amazing to research and write
is a great background for both nonprofit
and for-profit boards it's and it's easy
to read I was telling aadmi who said
she's about to read it if you read the
first chapter and last chapter tells you
the whole story
and then the inside tractor's ones on
climate ones on human rights which
includes privacy and privacy issues and
security issues
and that and trafficking a whole mix of
things education health care the
different chapters on different issues
so you can pick and choose and read them
in whatever order you like but I think
both of those would be very good and all
the companies I write about have
partnerships with nonprofits so it will
help you understand a lot of the realm
of Mount profits and that when you're on
nonprofit boards partnering with your
company there are really rich
opportunities that are win-win and she
has a discount code up here yeah the is
I just give your game a discount of
thirty five percent which is
unbelievable of here a woman I didn't
know to ask
and then someone I know there will you
should punch sometimes like so I did and
I got it but this is two years later
okay anyhow doesn't the discount code
well thank you so much for your insights
and thanks for women leading privacy for
setting this up I think it was the first
time of having a session like this and
also thank you everyone for having
wonderful questions I know both of you
will stay up here for a little bit I
think the next session in here is not
for twenty minutes so if you have any
questions please come up and thank you
again everyone
you